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Caedrel
Here for a while
(12/19/02 9:27:34 pm)
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Tools of Excellence (weaponsmithing)
Not strictly a RttToEE question, but in "the Best of the Boards" in Siobharek's, SolidSnake's, Thrommel's, and Tristan Darque's Replacing the Orcs, there's mention of these belonging to Pirran Oranac:
Tools of Excellence (weaponsmithing), which give a +10 enhancement bonus to all Weaponsmithing rolls (value: 2000 gp, caster level 5, Prereq.: Creator must be dwarf or have 5 ranks in Craft [Weaponsmithing]
They sound exactly like something I've been discussing with one of my players for a little while now - where is this item from, and are there any discussions about how it's been created & priced as a magic item?
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Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(12/20/02 12:19:55 am)
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Re: Tools of Excellence (weaponsmithing)
I just made them up. They're priced exactly like Boots/cloaks of elvenkind and the ring of climbing. The formula is bonus^2 * 20. Funny coincidence that you've discussed them with your player. Mind saying what the discussion is about?
Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing. |
Caedrel
Here for a while
(12/22/02 7:18:48 pm)
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Re: Tools of Excellence (weaponsmithing)
Nah, no problems at all, although it may bore most people to tears.
Caveat: it has been several months since we had the last of those discussions (we've been running a different party through some other modules, and it took on a life of its own - some of those PCs are actually about to come across to our original RttToEE campaign).
Anyway, he's playing a Dwarven cleric of Moradin with a strong magic item creation orientation. He's aiming to make the more powerful magic items himself - he's made his Gauntlets of Ogre Power, next on his agenda is the Belt of Giant Strength, and one day he'd really, really like a Hammer of Thunderbolts (you know, the one out of the G1-3 classic "Against the Giants").
Anyways, he knows it's cheaper by half to make these himself, so he can get them quicker than if he had to pay market prices. The main hassle is the length of time it takes to make them - not so much for the enchantment (which, from memory, is fixed at 1 day per 1,000gp) but to make the masterwork items required. That length of time is dependent on the quality of his crafter work, hence the interest in tools that help speed that along (the gauntlets took 3 weeks after some pretty ordinary rolls).
He was using the formula, but knowing that wondrous items throw up the most exceptions, I was looking for analogies in the DMG. I also think he was looking at a +30 bonus to start with, for which I think we only had one example (the ring of jumping?). I think we'd basically agreed on a +10 competence bonus and the same price as the other +10 magic items when we got another rules supplement on dwarves (name escapes me at the moment) that was good overall, but had these anvils of forging or something that gave a decent plus to certain craft checks for only 800gp.
Argh! I know I don't have to allow things into my game if I don't want them, but I don't like exercising DM fiat without decent analysis. My player wasn't pushing it, but I guess I was more concerned that I had missed something in my deliberations.
The other thing that has bothered to me was that, if these items are as cheap as they seem, why aren't they part of the equipment of every master smith? My player's PC dwarf has a disciple type thing with a master smith, and they've spent some time with Shooma from the Speaker in Dreams, as well as spent time in Durgeddin's Forge of Fury, and to date all I've allowed is a +2 circumstance bonus from working with a master smith's masterwork forge. I suspect I'll make it part of the rite of passage as a dwarven journeyman smith to make your own set of Tools of Excellence, and as such that they're intensely personal items amongst dwarves.
*whew* I dunno if you expected all of that when you asked, but I couldn't stop myself - the context just seemed too important to leave out. I guess it's part of my trying to be the sort of DM ("GM" nowadays?) that I want to be for my players...
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Siobharek
Still here? Wow.
(12/25/02 11:52:33 am)
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Re: Tools of Excellence (weaponsmithing)
DM now, DM forever (none o' that GM crap here  )
Why don't every mastersmith in existence have Tools of Excellence? Well, maybe no one ever thought about it. Sounds lame, but then again, some of the inventions/discoveries made in human history seem kinda like "why not earlier".
OR... Maybe a true craftsman wouldn't use that kind of tools because it would demean his own personal skills.
Or... They do, in fact. Well, not all, but those who promise to help the creator make a few items can have a couple items made. And that might even keep a few craftsmen from using the tools.
With regards to the Dwarven supplement: Change the price of whatever item they're talking about. I actually think that the DMG pricing for skill bonuses seems pretty solid. And a +30 bonus?! IIRC the +10 requires that the creator has 5 ranks in the skill in question, right? Or access to someone who does. So it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to require that a +30 bonus requires 15 ranks? And what honest master smith can take the time out for Moradin knows how many weeks of fooling around with magic?
Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing. |
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