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Grumgarr
Here for a while
(1/24/03 6:53:59 am)
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Black Spike Door stats
So the Door is sentient and has some spell-like abilities...but what are its stats?

What DC do saves vs. its spells use?
What about its own saves (vs. Disintegrate, or whatever).
And skills? (Sense Motive? Spot? Listen?)

Have I just missed this, or is this info not in the book?

...shameless *bump*
Grumgarr

Edited by: Grumgarr at: 1/24/03 7:50:16 am
Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(1/24/03 1:30:25 pm)
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Re: Black Spike Door stats
Hmm, tricky. A a good thing, you brought it up. It's gonna be errata'ed once we reach a consensus. Highest level spell is 5th, meaning that it's gotta have at least Int 15. A standard lvl 10 wizard (it's mentioned to cast the spells as a lvl 10 caster, and because the spells are fixed and because I'd say it would be easier to imbue an item with intelligence than with a force of personality) would have Int 17 (15 at start, +2 for stat increases).

I think I'd go with that: Int 17, Wis 10 (why need common sense when you've got detect good/evil/thoughts?), Cha 10. So DC 13 + spell level. Oh, and no one's gonna argue it's a construct, right? It's physical stats would be Str --, Dex 0, Con --. Wouldn't they?

Now to its saves. At 120 hp, it should be around 21 HD (Constructs use d10s for Hit Dice) using average hit points. At max (and why not?), it shoud have 12 Hit Dice. It can't have less, really. It has no good saves, so at 12 HD, it has a base save adjustment of +4. So it's saves should be Fort +4, Ref -1, Will +4.

Constructs have no skills, but one might certainly argue that it should have exactly the skils you ask about: Listen, Spot, and Bluff. Suggestions (I suggest +12 for each, that's 1 rank per Hit Die).

Anyway, that's all, I think. Either that, or make it into an immobile, spell-slinging iron golem.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Zagig
Here for a while
(1/25/03 5:16:53 am)
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Re: Black Spike Door stats
I think that what you have looks right, Siobharek. Why would it have Listen, Spot or Bluff, though?

Infiniti2000
Here to stay
(1/25/03 7:14:23 am)
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ezSupporter
Re: Black Spike Door stats
I think he meant Listen, Spot, or Sense Motive, like Grumgarr wrote. I would give the door saves as a 10th level sorcerer, base +3 +3 +7, +2 for being adamantine, total +5 +0 +9.

If you can that the door is a construct with intelligence. Remember that as a construct it is immune to anything requiring a Fort save unless that attack affects objects, as well as a number of other immunities, but if it has intelligence, you might rule it is affected by some mind-affecting spells (e.g. potion of glibness).

However, the module says sorcerer, not wizard, so perhaps his charisma could be 17 and, like a normal construct, his intelligence would be --?

Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(1/25/03 2:11:33 pm)
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Re: Black Spike Door stats
D'oh. Sense Motive, not Bluff, thanks Infiniti2K.

I'll be... I'd have sworn it says caster. But if it doesn't have an Intelligence score, it won't be intelligent as such, will it? Then it'll just respond to a set series of commands and that's it. With Intelligece, I think it becomes a bit more of a challenge to get past (at one point I wrote up a role-playing suggestion for the door: It used to show an open face to the world, but now it's unhinged, unable to get a handle on stuff and just wants closure, yadda, yadda. I won't this time. Oh... I did :o ).

PC: "Look, we're envoys from... from another temple of... of-er Tharizdun. Now let us in!"

Door: "Nope. Try again. And this time, hide the holy symbol, Paladin-boy."

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Grumgarr
Here for a while
(1/26/03 5:52:08 am)
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The Door's Stats
Great guys - thanks for the suggestions, they look good.

I've played the thing as >sort of< intelligent, up to a point, so I'm going to go on with that - but it also MUST open for a Master Key, so even the naffest of bluffers has a way past it. Effectively, it's programmed, and can't break its own rules, even if it thinks the Master Key wielders are phonies.
AFAIC it's a construct, so gets construct immunities, but is not the sharpest tool in the box, just clever enough to follow its program as gatekeeper. Plus its got a hardness rating, which I give to all constructs, so that fits for me :)

And I'm ruling that once it starts to open, it can no longer use its spell-like abilities...though it can still telepathically alert the T-Rexes.

Like the other Doors, it will stay open (and inactive) until three rounds after the opener has moved away (more than 5') from it, then will close over 1 full round - at which point it can join in on any melee, inside or out.

So I think I'll stat the thing as:

The Door (large construct)
AC 4 (-1 Size, -5 Dex)
Hardness 20 (adamantine) Break DC 50
HD 12 - HP 120
Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 17 (Str -, Con -, Dex 0).
Fort +4, Ref -1, Will +4
Spot +12, Listen +12, Sense Motive +12
SQ: Construct Immunities, Fire Immunity, SR 30
SA: Telepathic (range 100'), Spell-like abilities, each three times per day (save DC 13 + spell level):
Detect Good, Detect Evil, Detect Thoughts, Lightning Bolt, Wall of Fire, Fear, Summon Monster V, Dismissal, Feeblemind

Grumgarr - whose PCs are so terrified of the T-Rexes he now wonders if his they'll ever see the Door again.

Edited by: Grumgarr at: 1/26/03 6:01:22 am
Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(1/26/03 9:47:29 am)
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Re: The Door's Stats
Everyone's OK with that?

If there are no comments, I'll errata it in the morning (my time).

Edit: Which I have now done (with the save bonuses).

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Edited by: Siobharek  at: 1/27/03 1:43:01 am
Infiniti2000
Here to stay
(1/26/03 9:18:39 pm)
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ezSupporter
Re: The Door's Stats
You should still give the door the +2 save for adamantine. The final saves then should be +6, +1, +6. Looks good, though. Grumgarr, I certainly hope your players go back! :)

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