|
Author
|
Comment
|
Kylearanon
Here for a while
(3/25/03 5:36 am)
Reply
|
Chymon grappled ?
Hmm, I am not very much into the grappling rules. But what is this about -20 for not being grappled etc ?
I can´t see a dragon like Chymon snatching a gnome and then counting as grappled herself ?!?!?!?
Isn´t it more like chewing a gum while kicking some butt on the way ?
Kyle
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(3/25/03 4:45 pm)
Reply
|
So..
What should I do if they try to run away? Thrommel WILL get one of them dominated.......The stalkers WILL tell Hedrack......How is Varachan even supposed to know about the intruders, again?
Eltern
|
Boden Blagden
Here for a while
(3/25/03 7:45 pm)
Reply
|
Re: Outer Fane happy
I know the Outer Fane is going to be happy pretty soon. I am for now on leaving all remaining areas in the CRM on the highest alert for the PCs. Hedrack has full descriptions of them, thanks to good recon, and they constantly go back and forth from the CRM to town. I will have Hedrack scrying on them an aweful lot and there will be ambushes and people ready for them. Ukemil is the next on the list to ambush them when they come back from town. I am thinking of throwinf the Invisible Stalkers in on this also. And A few days after that the PCs are going to meet Thrommel. I have made it to where Hedrack is really sick of these PCs. Even though one or two of them may die in a battel they keep coming back and defeating all odds that they come up against. Also the Sucubus is staying in town and watching the PCs there. She knows exactly who they pic up as new members and such and has that info relayed to Hedrack.
I am such an evil Dm isn't it great.
|
Andorax
Still here? Wow.
(3/26/03 7:46 am)
Reply
|
Re: So..
Eltern, if they try to run away (abandoning their friend), that's their choice. With the given timetable, there is enough time for the PCs to deal with the ambush and take one or two quick attempts at finding and rescuing their missing man before Thrommel's Q&A is done.
Also, as per my suggestion, Varachan knows about the intruders because Hedrack, unsuspecting, tells him...via the Master/Slave ring if you take my suggestion, or the Contact Amulet if you don't care for that idea. Varachan IS the "second in command" of the Outer Fane, after all, and whom Hedrack is most likely to notify in a sticky situation.
Note that if you don't buy into my Master/Slave ring thing, Hedrack can notify the assassin(s) manually, and one of them can go as a runner to the Elite Warriors, and one of them can be sent on to get Naquient, etc...delay the timetable a bit if you go this route, for both the main attack force and the ambush force.
"Whadda ya mean, Orcs get levels too?!?" |
Eltern
Here for a while
(3/28/03 6:53 pm)
Reply
|
Kewl
Had about 40ish minutes worth of play this week, purty sad. However, what did happen was pretty good. The stalkers left, and the players spent the next several rounds, long enough for the stalkers to get to Heddy, swinging around at squares where they thought the stalkers still were. Old Throm dog showed up, coalescing (sp?) from gaseous form behind them, and interrogated them something good. The party was pretty startled that someone actually knew who they were and what they were doing. He dominated the party fighter and took him with him back to the coffin room. The party just stood there as they walked away, not wanting to go back into the tentacle trap room. The party sorc (who is a shade) ran into the room right before the door closed, jumping over it as it came close to closing. This, of course, was to his detriment, as the tentactles immediatley went off on him. We'll deal with that next session.
The party didn't have much time to think, however, as Bethe, Victor, and the stalkers came back and started beating down. I'm having the assassins simply wade right in, using the stalkers to flank party members so the death attacks are most effective. The cleric knocked off one of the stalkers, but doesn't really know it, since the stalker is still invisible.
Hmmm, now what? Thrommel was distinctly unimpressed by the party, and will probably show up to "the meeting" in the greater temple with Brontur (the fighter) when the time comes.
Eltern
|
 Infiniti2000
Still here? Wow.
(3/29/03 2:06 pm)
Reply
ezSupporter
|
Re: Chymon grappled ?
"But what is this about -20 for not being grappled etc?" -Kylearanon
If you are attempting to grapple someone, you may take a -20 penalty. If you do so and succeed, you are not considered grappled, though the other combatant is considered grappled. Thus, you maintain your Dex bonus to AC, threaten areas around you, and can continue with your remaining attacks. It doesn't apply to Chymon, but a small or tiny creature using improved grab does not get the special size modifier penalty on this grapple check, but does get their size modifier (the +1 or +2 bonus). Also, improved grab only works on creatures that are 1 size category less (or smaller).
The MMII is written a little more clearly than the MM. Look in the beginning of the book under Special Attacks and Improved Grab.
Keep in mind that Chymon's grapple check is +37; BAB +19, Strength +10, Huge +8. A -20 penalty is not such a big deal. 
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/3/03 8:28 pm)
Reply
|
Ehhh...
Eh.....I must have effed up......bad......
We have a party of 5:
Elven-Shade Sorc7 (ECL 9)
Human Pelor Cleric9
Half-elf Rogue 9 (has the demonstone, but not a lot has been done with it)
Human Monk 8
Gnome Wiz8
Minotaur Fighter 1 (Note, he's Huge. 18' tall. Took the massive feat, and he's getting some extra minuses for it, like no magical healing)
The party fought the assassins, killed one of them and a stalker, and the other assassin (Victor) and the other stalker fled to Hedrack. Almost immediately after Varachan shows up, and hurries them out of the Outer Fane, saying he would come for them soon. Varachan goes to the meeting of Heddy and all them, says he'll go and beat down the intruders. Hedrack decides it's ok, and Varachan goes off to the Air Bridge Complex, where the party had been sleeping (They have convinced the complex they are important and not enemies).
Varachan then basically tells them about the prison, and how at around noon Hedrack would be sleeping. The party then goes to get Tarren, convinces him to join their anti-Hedrack force, goes into the OF through the Air Door (led by Varachan), gets out the unruly prisoners (Azer, Elf, and Lamasu), and get ready to go marching against Hedrack, all led by Varachan.
Here's the kicker. They go to THROMMEL, and try to sway him to their side......I agreed. He helps take out Hedrack, they move his coffin. (Question: How does Hedrack have control over the coffin? How could he surround it with water or whatnot?) They all agree to this, then go up, around the areas 25 and 18, and are ready to enter Hedrack's room, all 12 of them, while he's sleeping.
Something tells me this should not have happened.
Help,
Eltern
|
Cordo Crowfoot
Here to stay
(4/4/03 5:06 am)
Reply
|
Re: Ehhh...
Maybe it's all part of Hedrack's evil plan! Mwa ha ha ha ha ha! 
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/4/03 6:58 am)
Reply
|
ok..
I've got over a week to figure out what to do, ah blessed Spring Break  It looks like there are options here:
I could have everything be as it appears to be. Varachan did everything quite well, and has chosen his battles wisely. I think that everything checks out with this, except.....Thrommel.
Another way would be that Heddy has been scrying on Varachan, learned of this plot, and is NOT in his room. Of course, he could have gotten Thrommel on his side, too. Hmmm........that sounds........deadly.......and........quite fun
Of course, then, Thrommel could switch sides, again....
Either way, I want Varachan to be who he says he is, because, well darn it, it's the way it's gonna be 
So Heddy's really one room off or so, with the Drow.....And Chymon...and Naq....And what's his name with the lions.....Owwiee
Sounds like it's going to be a lot of dice rolling for me, with 10-odd full fledged NPCs duking it out.
Time to whip out DM's Familiar
Eltern
|
msherman
Here for a while
(4/4/03 8:02 am)
Reply
|
Re: ok..
Thrommel seems like the sort who is loyal to no-one, and would costantly be playing both sides against the middle, only looking out for his own best interests. So if he thinks he can cut a deal with the party to get his coffin back, he would, but he would definitly stab them in the back when given the opportunity, like say after Hedrack is defeated and everyone's resting licking their wounds.
|
Thrommel
Can't leave now (mod)
(4/4/03 8:03 am)
Reply
|
Re: ok..
I really think that set-up will yield a complete TPK. You might dogpile on the party like that after they've already struck a devastating blow to the Outer Fane, but as it is - why would Hedrack be bunkered down with so many heavies? Does he have ANY suspicion the Outer Fane has been breached?
Another thing to consider is that your party is a little on the underpowered side for tackling the OF. The prisoners are so weak, they should be a non-factor: one unholy blight will wipe them out unless the party has spent a lot of resources healing them. Varachan has no real abilities - he's REALLY putting himself at unnecessary risk here. Thrommel is a wild card, they're taking some serious chances trusting him. Tarren provides some interesting abilities, but he's also NE.
I'm not keeping up with everyone's campaign logs, are you running an evil party?
Anyhow, I think you'd need a MINIMUM 13th level party, buffed to the gills and ready for anything, to realistically take on Chymon, Hedrack, the Drow, Naquent, AND Ukemil and the dire lions. Just pitting the party against Chymon and Hedrack is an EL 16 encounter.
Couple things to keep in mind:
-Chymon has guard duty to perform, she also has a huge phat pile of crazy mad l00t to sit on. She LIKES her little lair and will not be too keen to leave it.
-The drow are embassadors, not Hedrack's lackeys. Their only combat involvement will primarily be self-defense. You don't ask your dinner guests to kill the cockroaches in your cupboards.
-In general, unless the OF is in a heightened state of alert, everyone has something better to do than sit around waiting to stage an ambush. Hedrack needs to report to the Inner Fane, Naquent is in the library, etc.
We need to think of some alternatives here, and I don't think "Thrommel is leading them into a trap" is one of them.
1) They jump Hedrack, but he's not asleep - he's preparing a report to the doomdreamers. That forbiddance is going to be tough to get through. Plus, look at his spell list - HOLY CRAP: disintegrate, phantasmal killer, slay living, confusion, insect plague. Not to mention the word of recall he's bound to drop. (In fact, knowing Hedrack, that's the first thing he does on round one: tactical retreat.) If the party can somehow pull this one off, the cult will have been dealt a serious blow.
2) Hedrack's not there, but they have a 'random' encounter with Ukemil and the lions. Or they stumble across Naquent. Maybe they catch Naquent in Hedrack's quarters while he's off reporting to the DD's. Oho, now things get interesting -- WHAT is she doing there snooping through his stuff? Figure out who might reasonably be nearby when combat breaks out and how many rounds it takes them to notice and arrive.
Granted, you have an army of a party - but a third of them are in no condition to fight (I don't really understand why any of the prisoners would agree to go on a sortie in the first place) and another third of them are untrustworthy.
It won't take much to whittle the group back down to the PC's.
It seems to me that you've gone easy on the party with all the prisoners and alliances and now you're attempting to overcompensate by throwing a huge ambush at them.
My advice is, don't overcompensate - just drop in an encounter to restore the balance. Trust me, they'll have plenty of challenges on their hands if you can sideline all the extra help and the PC's are left to their own devices.
-Thrommel, who has a huge phat pile of crazy mad l00t to go sit on.
|
Infiniti2000
Still here? Wow.
(4/4/03 8:16 am)
Reply
ezSupporter
|
Re: ok..
You set up the plan via Varachan. The players did nothing except try to enlist additional forces from Tarren and Thrommel. Be careful not to become attached to the success of basically your plan. I say this only to make you feel better about changing what might happen. Some ideas:
1. Everything works as is, everyone attacks Hedrack en masse through the forbiddance. Good luck, Hedrack, and c'est la via.
2. Hedrack is aware of the massing attack and enlists other's aid, but all of the NPC's actually support the attack. Thus, it's the party+Varachan+Thrommel+Tarren+prisoners vs. Hedrack+Chymon+Naquent+Ukemil. Big battle. Might be fun though, and probably an even match.
3. Go more along the lines of #1, but have the evil guys in the group not exactly stay on the party's side. For instance, some of the prisoners might not like being in the same group with Thrommel (knowing who he is) or even Varachan, claiming him to be the second in command. Thrommel might even take the opportunity to attack Varachan during the fight as revenge against some past actions (Varachan was a 12th level evil cleric who, say, rebuked Thrommel at some point, now that Varachan is not a cleric, Thrommel can dominate him and suck him dry). Tarren might turn on Varachan, too, knowing him to really be an evil cleric in support of the Temple. Tarren also might have an inherent hatred of the lamasu.
4. Hedrack is sleeping with Naquent (surely I'm not the first to realize the possibilities here?). However, Naquent is currently awake and reading a book while Hedrack sleeps. I recommend The Manufacture and Use of Jawbreakers of Everyday Torture for light reading.
Whatever you do, Hedrack's first action should be blasphemy followed by word of recall to the greater temple (if is injured or unprepared). So, unless the party kills him before he can react, he will reappear shortly, fully buffed, with Naquent and Chymon and Ukemil in tow.
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/4/03 11:39 am)
Reply
|
Tarren
Ok, for everyone's reference :
No, the party is not evil, though one of the party members has the demonstone, another is CN(which in the hands of a bad RPer you know usually equates to random acts of evil when the player thinks there will not be retribution).
Tarren despises Hedrack. With a passion. He was tricked by Hedrack into helping make the altar that improsend his Lady of Decay. The party had a long talk with Tarren when they first met him, and were rightfully freaked out by him (He's a cannibal) and got wind of his hatred for Hedrack and the DDs. He will do -anything- to take out the Fanes, but isn't stupid, he doesn't want to die if it's not going to help. Only when the party gave him a lot of info (About Varachan, the prisoners, and how easily they could access Heddy's bedchambers) did he agree to this. He will kill Hedrack, or make sure he is killed, and then probably try to get out of there, unless he sees that the tactical situation is more in his favor. Another possibility is that at the sight of Hedrack he goes more looney than he already his, and goes postal on him. I'll have to decide that....
The prisoners: The paladin would want to fight alongside them, the lamasu would, too, and the azer. I thought this is what I got from their descriptions, am I wrong?  The party healed them up, so that kinda takes care of that issue. The lamasu and paladin were NOT happy about Varachan, until they were convinced of his repentence (Namely the paladin detecting him).
NOBODY was happy about Thrommel. They tried to sneak by through the tentacle room, but the lamasu refused to say the pass-phrase, and Throm-dawg was alerted by the ensuing sounds of the tentacles. (What happens when a person says the pass-phrase -after- the tentacles get him? The party was yelling at him to say the pass phrase, and after a couple low grapple checks, the lamasu said it. I ruled that the tentacles went away.  Seems to make sense for those times you accidently forget.) Thrommel wanted to know what was going on, and the party cleric immediately jumped into a bid for help. Risky, considering Varachan had specifically told the party that he was a wildcard, and that nobody trusted him. Also bad RPing on his part, since he's a cleric of PELOR. (He got an anti-RP XP bonus for that, not too big, given the circumstances, but...) Thrommel did the I want my coffin routine, and the deal was set. Nobody was happy with this, but when the minotaur tried to attack Thrommel, he just dominated him, and that just shut everybody up real quick.
Oh, and no, I'm afraid that I have not had a campaign log, but details of the campaign are spread over many threads
(So how is it that Hedrack has such control over Thrommel's coffin? Is there some trap door to a river I don't know about?)
Yes, it was my plan with the prisoners, I liked the ideas presented on the boards about that. (Thrommel, was that you, or was it Infiniti?)
Current thoughts, then:
Everyone on guard duty will stay on guard duty, no drow involved. Though I thought the Drow were "courting" the temple, trying to work their way into things.
Varachan is going to stay out of the fight as much as possible. Partly because he's wimpy, but mainly because: If this screws up, and they know it was him, he dies. So he may not even be in the room.
Thrommel wants this to go through, and for at least some of the party to live, so that his coffin can be carried out to some nice pretty locale where he can plot nefarious deeds without fear of reprisal. If the party does not want to comply: Domination. However, he may take measures to make himself unrecognizable for if the situation does not work out, such as an alternate form, though that's pretty weak.
The idea of Naq being in the room while Heddy sleeps seems to be a nice balance between the ideas of TPK and THedrackK. Varachan never enters the room, so he stays gold. Hedrack escapes to the Greater Temple. Can he take Naq with him? I don't think so...
I realize how much of a beast Hedrack is, especially with the forbidance. I think he will get away. The thing is, Thrommel can take him out rather easily, it seems. I don't understand why he couldn't have simply sucked him dry in his sleep long before.
Eltern
|
Andorax
Still here? Wow.
(4/4/03 12:04 pm)
Reply
|
Re: Tarren
Might I suggest another possible option?
Thrommel IS going to use his abilities to "hedge his bets". He wants the PCs to survive, but he wants a backup in case they don't.
Can you manufacture a period of time where Thrommel could have had about 15 seconds alone with Tarren and/or the Paladin? My bet is that he'll have Dominated those two in short order, commanding them to "keep their cover" and not reveal said Domination...under pain of...well...lots of pain.
These two will not be reliable combattants, and will (at Thrommel's orders) withdraw at the first serious risk of failure. He will need lackeys to help him.
I like the suggestion of Naquient being in Hedrack's quarters at the time. Another possability would be to add some "window dressing"...a pair of innocent, charmed slave girls in Hedrack's chambers. Something to give the PCs pause about lobbing area-of-effect spells at him to roast him.
"Whadda ya mean, Orcs get levels too?!?" |
Thrommel
Can't leave now (mod)
(4/4/03 2:42 pm)
Reply
|
Re: Tarren
I guess my reading of the description of the prisoners was a little more along the lines of "here's what I know, I'm really freaked out from having been tortured and imprisoned, can you please show me the door now?"
But it's a moot point now anyhow. I see where you got the posse from.
I really don't see Hedrack sticking around when faced with a force this size (especially when Thrommel is turning traitor on him). He's going to word of recall to the Greater Temple and put together a force to deal with the intruders.
That means if Naquent is there, the party spends two rounds killing her and then has to find some sort of defensive point. The only other avenue for success I can see is that Thrommel could lead them directly to the Greater Temple, having made a good strategic guess where Hedrack had gone.
That would be a climactic battle and probably would limit the number of supporting forces Hedrack would be able to muster. Varachan could go around giving the guards contradictory orders and spreading some confusion among the regulars as well. Only problem is that Hedrack can step into the circle in the Greater Temple and escape to the Inner Fane if need be.
Btw, the running water and coffin bit is just something I made up to explain why Thrommel is so enslaved to the doomdreamers. The idea is that if he doesn't do what Hedrack wants, they turn some valve to surround his coffin with running water so he can't rest there. That's purely my own take on the situation, but it does make sense and explains why neither party particularly trusts the other.
Good luck,
-Thrommel, who steps into the circle and escapes to the Gamer's Lounge.
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/4/03 7:18 pm)
Reply
|
Halfling
The halfling baker, the one with the demonic left arm, that's what he was like. I had a ball rping out his blubbering little pathetic-ness. The party really couldn't figure out what to do with him, since he couldn't/didn't want to help fight at all, he was too much of an emotional wreck.
I guess my question is, how can Thrommel even possibly -not- kill Hedrack? Hedrack will probably get away to the Greater Temple, and Naq will try to run there, too, but die trying. Thrommel can just eat him for breakfast. Ay! He might even be able to dominate him! Odds are in his favor...
Who would Hedrack try to get? There's a lot of people that probably don't wanna move, like Chymon and the earth elemental, for instance.
Eltern
|
Infiniti2000
Still here? Wow.
(4/5/03 10:18 am)
Reply
ezSupporter
|
Re: Halfling
Thrommel cannot beat Hedrack, no way no how. Hedrack has a little ability we like to call rebuke/command. Thrommel would certainly not want to join a fight against Hedrack. In fact, if he does, he will certainly be commanded to attack the party, then bolstered, and the party will be doomed.
Hedrack is the undisputed commander of the Outer Fane. He can command anyone/anything there he wants, including Daagra the Annis. If the players have entered the Outer Fane, he will not hold back either, so DO NOT MAKE IT EASY for them. Punish them now and quickly so they do not think they are having an easy time. If you want them to attack Hedrack in his quarters and he is asleep, AND he makes an escape, the crap will hit the fan quickly and Hedrack will organize the entire Outer Fane in defense. It is what any smart commander would do, insane or not.
"-Thrommel, who has a huge phat pile of crazy mad l00t to go sit on."
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/5/03 12:38 pm)
Reply
|
Turning
Hedrack would have to roll a 15 on his turn check just to rebuke Thrommel, and cannot command him at all.
The Annis was killed, fyi, when the party went to the prison.
Eltern
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/5/03 3:33 pm)
Reply
|
Word of Recall
Oh, and it would seem Hedrack could take Naq with him. Word of Recall takes himself and 700 extra lbs with him. I doubt she weighs that much (including his and her equipment).
However, Thrommel will still probably go right to the Greater Temple, and Hedrack has only a 30%chance of turning him, and then only for 10 rounds (I know 10 rounds is a LOT, but in this case, with the rest of the group trying to beat down Hed and Naq, he'll probably live).
I don't have the BoVD, one of my players does, but he's away on break. Could someone detail how the Master Ring/Slave Rings work? I want to know how Hedrack can contact everyone, who he can contact, etc.
Thanks,
Eltern
|
Eltern
Here for a while
(4/11/03 10:58 am)
Reply
|
::bump::
: ump::
Anyone got details on the master/slave ring? Or even wishy washy generalities?
Thanks,
Eltern
|
|
Okay -- Your Turn
Email This To a Friend
Topic Commands
Click to receive email notification of replies 
Click to stop receiving email notification of replies