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Boden Blagden
Here for a while
(3/29/03 2:27 pm)
Protection from Evil and the Invisible Stalkers.
Would Prot. from evil block the Invisible stalkers from attacking someone completely, or would it just make it harder to hit the person. Are the Stalkers in the Fanes Evil.

Here to stay
(3/29/03 4:39 pm)
Though the stat will not say that, I would asssume that that they are evil since the deeper the fane they live in, the greater chance of Invisible Stalker being (or becoming evil). If they are under control of Hedrack, the chance of becoming evil is 75 percent.

Being elemental, I would assume that they are neutral evil. You may want to throw in that they were once create by Air Temple (or summon) and end up paying to the tributes, hoping to raise their place to the top. Sort of like fraternity politics where the competitive win its position to the top. Fire would quickly win since it is known to be "fiercely" competitor.

Here for a while
(3/29/03 9:50 pm)
Re: Hmm
I do not allow protection from X spells to hedge out creatures just because they are Outsiders. My ruling is that it only works in that way if the creature in questioned is summoned. Note that summoning and calling are two different things.

Creatures brought to the Prime by way of a planar ally spell or something similar are called, not summoned. Thus I have ruled that they are not hedged out by the protection spells.

Monsters summoned with a monster summoning spell or nature's ally spell are completely hedged out by these spells, however.

There is much debate on this topic, though, and has been brought up before. It ultimately depends on your interpretation of the spell, whatever that may be.

Still here? Wow.
(3/29/03 10:18 pm)
Summoning vs. Calling
I agree with your assessment, SSShadowcat7 (that's a lot of S's for two words!), and I'm pretty sure the rules support it that way. So, the answer is that no, protection from evil does not hedge out the invisible stalkers.

Here for a while
(3/29/03 10:26 pm)
Re: Hmm
There is much debate (mostly becuase the spell descriptions have "summoned or conjured", one of which is a subset of the other), but I think the core rules are pretty clear about it.

Notice that under the Calling section of the Conjuration description in Ch 10 of the PHB that magic circle spells are recommended as a trap for called creatures. Those spells specifically state that they are 'As protection from..." but with larger effects and duration. Thus, if circle spells protect you against called creatures, protection must as well.

As I think we hashed out some time ago in a thread far, far away there are many other plausible reasons for the majority of the elementals and outsiders to be in the CRM without being called (or summoned). Deliberate gates are one obvious way (cf. grells in the moathouse) and the other is a concentrated effort by the cultists to seek out/invite/etc. outsiders who came to Material Plane on their own time and just happen to be hanging out.

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The guy from Belgium
Here for a while
(3/30/03 4:05 am)
Re: Hmm
well, i have my own system regarding protection from evil, and the way i see it, it's way overpowered for a 1st level spell (but that's my opinion... +2 ac, +2 to all saves and hedge out outsiders and mind control... against one particular allignment, but since you're always fighting EVIL things, it's almost always on)

a few remarks though...

it's duration is quite short (1 min/lvl) so it won't provide continuous defense against the stalkers

the stalkers are probably evil (so if you rule prot from evil works, it will hold them back)

the stalkers aren't stupid... thay might get a tingling sensation as they approach a character protected by a protection from evil. they might put 1 and 1 together and bide their time, knowing that the protection will wear off soon enough...

So there are many ways to circumvent it (if you allow prot from evil to work in this way)


Boden Blagden
Here for a while
(3/30/03 6:39 am)
Re: Hmm
Cool, thanks for the responses guys. The reason I asked this is because one of the Invisible stalkers killed the sorceror in my party while he had Prot. from evil on. And he saw that somewhere in the rule book that level 20 monks were effected that way against the protection spells. But I like SSShadowcat's use of it so I will use it that way.

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