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Xel565
Here for a while
(3/30/03 12:46 pm)
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Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
The PC's have just made it into the Outer Fane by way of the Fire Door. Now assuming that Hedrack is doing his whole scrying business will he send the cleric (can't remember his name) and his lions to deal with the adventurers, or will he just wait for them to find their death in the Outer Fane?
Xel
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Zenon
Here for a while
(3/30/03 5:45 pm)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
Be careful with the whole "assume Hedrack is Scrying" thing. There is a Spot roll to notice a Scry sensor (IIRC it's a Spot 20). By the time the PC's are hitting the OF, at least one of them (most likely a rogue) should have a good chance to be able to see that they are being Scry'd on.
This lets them know someone powerful is taking an interest in them and possibly do something about it (for example, my PC's run with Detect Scry up constantly [24 hr. duration PHB spell] and attempt to dispel the sensor when they see it). Assuming that the PC's don't see it can lead to some frustration on their part when you hit them with something big that they have no clue to expect.
How long has it been since they have taken out two or more temples? That's actually when Hedrack starts to take an interest in them, which should be a little before they hit the OF for the first time.
Also remember that Varachan has a Crystal Ball (it's listed in a sidebar). He's the one I figure starts the scrying game with the PCs first, Hedrack gets involved when things really start happening.
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Kylearanon
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(3/30/03 10:07 pm)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
Well, I might be terribly wrong here. But as far as my knowledge goes you use the scry skill to detect a person who is scrying on you, not the spot skill.
I don´t have the books with me here, but it states something like "everybody can use the scry skill to detect if you are being scried on. Apart from that you need a scrying device or spell to use it actively" !!!
Might be wrong though !
Kyle
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madfox
Still here? Wow.
(3/31/03 2:47 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
No, you are correct. It takes a scry check DC 20 to notice you are being scryed upon. Still, chances are the PCs will realize the scrying is going on at one point and if they are smart they will take precautions. I know that the PCs in my group in a previous campaign always started important conservations (like plans on how to infiltrate an enemy organization) by casting a detect magic and then they did this several times during the conversations. Then again, when you have got one wizard and two clerics in a group there are more then enough detect magics to make this viable.
As for the actions Hedrack would take when he learns about the PCs entering the fire door. I would say he would alert the red dragon first and depending on how dangerous he thinks the PCs are he would alert more people. If the PCs managed to kill the red dragon and he knows it, he will probably go into red alert and send in all his forces at once at the PCs. He might ignore fighting in the mines, but when people start invading your home, things become differently. Besides, the Doomdreamers might notice and somehow I don't think it is a good idea to appear incompetent in the eyes of the Doomdreamers.
Edited by: madfox at: 3/31/03 2:50:20 am
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Kylearanon
Here for a while
(3/31/03 3:16 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
you can determine if you are being scried on by using Detect Magic ? I never realized that. Does scrying leave an aura on the subject ?
Kyle
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madfox
Still here? Wow.
(3/31/03 3:19 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
It leaves a sensor that can be seen with see invisibility, so I would say it can be detected with a detect magic. Remember, detect magic in itself will not tell the PCs they are being scryed upon. It gives them a warning something is wrong that involves magic, for all they know there might a magical object doing the scrying or an invisible spy. When they did detect magic, they would try to learn more by searching and casting other spells. Anyway, the best way to spy upon the PCs is by infiltrating their group or by sneaking close and eavesdrop on their conversations.
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Zenon
Here for a while
(3/31/03 5:40 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
Ahh, my bad, I knew it was something (Smack! Scry, not Spot) that everyone had a shot at to notice. Scry is Int based, so don't forget to figure that into everyones skill when you're rolling.
Detect Magic is a rather short duration (minutes/lvl), so it might detect a long duration scry, but Hedrack could see the spell being cast (and possibly hear it is he had claraudience going) so he could make a Spellcraft check to identify it. If he did, he could shut down the Scry before they might locate the sensor and figure out what it is.
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madfox
Still here? Wow.
(3/31/03 6:46 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
Quote:
Detect Magic is a rather short duration (minutes/lvl), so it might detect a long duration scry, but Hedrack could see the spell being cast (and possibly hear it is he had claraudience going) so he could make a Spellcraft check to identify it. If he did, he could shut down the Scry before they might locate the sensor and figure out what it is.
He will do so most certainly, but then the PCs have reached their goal. They now can discuss there plans in peace and recasting the detect magic after a few minutes will make sure they keep talking alone.
[Edit note - silly spelling error, mixing words]
Edited by: madfox at: 3/31/03 6:47:05 am
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ZansForCans 
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(3/31/03 11:36 am)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
Even if he does cancel it, don't forget that there will be a lingering divination aura where the sensor was (i.e. near the subject). It will last for 1d6x10 minutes, so if they're expecting a scry, it should be easy for them to suspect that it was happening with just detect magic.
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Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(3/31/03 12:17 pm)
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Re: Hedrack's response to PC's in Outer Fane
To answer the original question, Hedrack would assume that the fire door guardian could handle everything, and that, if not, he would be informed by Naquent who's nearby, and whom he knows would be informed by the ogres.
If he does get word of intruders, he'll cast any long-term buffs that he's got - remember, he's careful. He'll put the assassin (/s? - is one or both there?) on alert, and he'll make sure that Varachan and Naquent are alerted as well (Varachan will be set to scry immediately).
When my group enters the Fane, I'll make sure that Hedrack has set up the best possible defense using local forces (here: The dragon and the ogres), and then he'll make sure that he's got as many options open as possible. He will not commit himself too much, but he might make sure that the drow and Ukemil and his lions are alerted and aware of the intrusion. On the other hand, Ukemil is a good mobile force, so he might be kept in reserve to pursue, once the intruders retreat (as he'd assume they're bound to - no one faces that dragon and moves on!), and the drow are still visitors and should not be made to feel too indispensible.
Thrommel is a wild card, IMHO. Let him out too soon, and who knows what he'll do. If he gets out, Hedrack's control of him is too tenuous for the vampire to be of much use. This assumption will be confirmed if you're running the "I want my coffin!" variant.
I would not draw too many forces to the combat, partly to avoid a TPK and partly because many of the forces are tied to other positions. Hedrack has set up a good defense and he trusts it. His main actions will be to monitor the battle and the group's progress (mainly through Varachan) and make sure that he has at least two outs.
Siobharek
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