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Kylearanon
Here for a while
(4/5/03 3:33 am)
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Swim into the mines ?
Is it possible to swim into the mines ?
Does the stalagos turn up to the surface anywhere outside the crater so that the players could get into the mines without using the two entrances ?
Kyle
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Trithereon
Here quite a while
(4/5/03 4:05 am)
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Re: Swim into the mines ?
A look at a topographic map of Crater Lake in Oregon shows a web of creeks that radiate outward from the crater. The maps shows a few springs but most the creeks appear to be fed from the surrounding watershed. The maxium depth of Crater Lake is 1,932 feet (589 meters) making the water clear and deep blue.
How does this answer your question? There may be a way to swim into the Stalagos but only if you were very, very small. The water pathways that terminate in springs are far too small for your average PC to traverse.
Flowing water is an extremely powerful force that erodes away rock at an geologically rapid pace. I'd think that anything larger then a spring would likely enlarge over the centuries into a full blown river, eventually draining the crater. As that hasn't happened ... and the fact that its name implies stagnation ... probably means that there is very little flow out of the crater to the surface.
However, deep underground rivers are possible routes into the Stalagos and the module does mention that the mines are accessable from the Underdark.
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Trithereon
Here quite a while
(4/5/03 6:59 am)
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Re: Swim into the mines ?
While we are on the subject ...
If you are interested in giving players other ways into the CRM then there is the Water Naga secret entrance near the Water Temple. Then there's the dwarf temple. These are detailed in the adventure.
However, I was troubled at times trying to understand the relationships between the many factions of the CRM and made some changes to the adventure and so I came up with other entrances/exits to help me make the CRM more dynamic.
For example, I was uncomfortable with all those orcs trapped between the Air Temple and Fire Temple. I felt the orc's numbers too large too be sustained by only what they could steal from the cultists. Orcs are fairly smart creatures and I supposed that they had tunneled their way into that section of the mines. They hunt and gather outside the CRM to feed themselves and more importantly to feed the hydra which protects them from the Air Temple. Therefore, I put a concealed orc entrance in the CRM.
Ditto Hobgoblins. Why can't these guys do some political intrigue on occasion as mercenaries or by smuggling in either allies, monsters and equipment under the other Temple's radars? Its a dangerous trade and I am sure more than one tribe of hobgoblin, orc, etc... has met an end in treachery. However, the promise of wealth and battle will always lure a fresh crop of enterprising young evil humanoids.
Ditto Dire Apes and Owlbears. These guys squeeze through caves ... like monsterous spelunkers ... in search of easily ambushed (War1 cultists) meat. PCs who want to use these caves to enter and exit the CRM must climb through a series of narrow caverns in somewhat indirect paths.
Just some thoughts
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Kylearanon
Here for a while
(4/5/03 8:17 am)
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Re: Swim into the mines ?
Hey thanks, Tritheron. Great answer.
And it is not really me who is looking for other entrances. But i definitely KNOW that my players will want to search for a way to enter by means of swimming.
You remember the moathouse ? As soon as they found the little river running into it (at the shaft) they began looking outside the moathouse for it.
So ... thanks again !!!
Kyle 
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