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xenoflare
A cup of coffee
(5/16/03 12:10 pm)
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motivations for going on..
Hi guys,

i'm currently in the Crater Ridge Mines, and it seems that my players are a mixed bag - the party is led by a hardcore homicidal secret-agent type who wants to transform the Temple of All Consumption into the Oerthian version of Waco, Texas. At the same time, other PCs have through their investigations become convinced that Tharizdun is somehow involved - they have been speaking to Lareth and been doing their own research, into finding out the 8 elemental princes and their roles in the world cosmology, and they wish to investigate further.

This is all well and good, but i've got a PC who's a central linchpin of the group because he's a more senior and respected person in terms of social dynamics. He is thinking of quitting the temple assault because he is terrified - he says he thinks he'll just let the furyondians and velunese take care of it. He's also got a cynical viewpoint of the world, and he wants to just retire somewhere where he can carve out a kingdom for his own, a reputation for his own, rather than die in some obscure temple.

Is there anyway that i can try to bolster his confidence, make him more connected to the ToAC plot? his plot hook was simple - he was adopted into a dueling family in Furyondy and left the family in disgrace, and was hired by a friend of the family to recover Jurrikath, the Bard in the Fire Temple's torture cells. He wants to just quit after rescuing Jurrikath.. and i need help with keeping him in. Any ideas?

Thanks.

xenoflare
A cup of coffee
(5/16/03 12:19 pm)
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some clarifications
some clarifications:

the player understands that this is a campaign based around the Temple plot, but he's been complaining a bit about how psychotic and dangerous the people are, and about how he won't get any recognition for fighting them. This is his second character - his first died in defeating the Dunwick Doomdreamer in a side trek to the Cradle of Madness, and he wanted to make a more mercenary character to distinguish himself from his first character, a paladin.

How do i get him to well, fight on? I'm asking cos he's a more senior player, so unconsiously his decisions can affect and influence the other players. Social dynamics and all that.

i've been working on several angles - he took the Singh Rager prestige class from Oriental Adventures, and there's some story link about dedication to chivalry and the residual resonance of a powerful Lion Totemic spirit in him. i've been trying to work on an angle where the Lion Totem is anticipating Imix's return to the world, and wants to fight Imix to gain dominance over his portfolio. Like a clash of titans, clash of the war gods thing. I'm being subtle on this because i don't want to make it too obvious and spoil my plot..

but i'm getting a bit tired, so i thought some advice from the respected hive mind would be of use. Thanks!

Andorax
A guitar
(5/16/03 1:07 pm)
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Re: some clarifications
IMC, Jurrikath, the Paladin in the Outer Fane cells, the Cleric corpse in Thrommel's room, the Monk in the Inner Fane's torture chambers (Sublevel I, I think) and Tymerian (the wizardess in Rastor) were all a part of the same adventuring party.

Rescuing Jurrikath would start off by showing what "they had done to him", which should be horrific enough. Add to that his feeble pleas (and Tymerian's stronger ones, once Jurrikath is rescued and back with her) to go looking for the rest of their companions, gives a motivation to continue on to the Outer Fane.

Also, one would hope that by the time they reach Jurrikath, they will already have taken down the requisite two temples so that Hedrack starts sending his hit squads after the party. This guy seems to have a decently developed willingness to get revenge, yes? Those can be seen as personal affronts to his prowess, trying to send assassins in the night and stuff like that.

Barring that, you may just have to tackle this from another angle, and let a less-dominant player drive the motivation bus for a while. I've enjoyed considerable success at coaxing a quiet player into a leadership role, and watched him blossom as a player because of it.

"Whadda ya mean, Orcs get levels too?!?"

Trithereon
A robot with powers
(5/17/03 1:55 am)
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Re: motivations for going on..
Perhaps you want to hint that should these "psychotic and dangerous people" succeed at their ultimate goal then there will be no world "where he can carve out a kingdom for his own"? Or at the very least, a drastically transformed world where reputation and kingdoms are worthless and where only Tharizdun matters.

Even the selfish will save the world when they become convinced that its destruction includes themselves and all they desire.

I like Andorax's idea but its only a temporary fix. Eventually there will be no members of the bard's party to rescue and evil clerics to exact revenge upon then you'll be left with the same "its somebody else's problem" attitude. Basically, it may be that you'll need to string him along with these little goals until he realizes that if he doesn't stop these psychotic priests that there will be no place to which to retire.

The guy from Belgium
A song from the sixties
(5/17/03 4:37 am)
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Re: motivations for going on..
he's a paladin right?

that means he's in some way connected to his god

give him some dreams...

he sees himself a few years after abandoning his quest

he has this really neat castle, several servants, a lovely wife and even a couple of intelligent kids running around the place

then, clouds gather overhead... lightning leaps from cloud to cloud and a purple rain starts to fall, burning everyone it touches to cinders...

he then hears a booming voice from his god... you have failed not only me, but yourself and all of humanity... now we must all pay the price!

that should get him into gear! :evil

Siobharek 
A guitar
(5/17/03 10:51 am)
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ezSupporter

Re: motivations for going on..
He's not a paladin. That was the player's previous character. But let the player discover what's really at stake. Then he should come around.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Caedrel
A song from the sixties
(5/17/03 8:23 pm)
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Re: motivations for going on..
The introduction of Thrommel might also make a big difference here. He's from Furyondy, so the the lost Crown Prince should haev a significant impact on him. If they go the redemption route (and I sinceerely hope that every party does!), then Thrommel is more than able to fill them in on the Doomdreamers' plans to end the world.

Jurrikath could probably give some indications as to Firre's ramblings about the same.

Varachan may take the risk and give them a bit more info about what's going on if he sees them wavering in their purpose.

Also, PCs with unknown pasts are great material to work with for the Doomdreamers, given their power to "know a secret" about someone just by looking at them...

xenoflare
A cup of coffee
(5/17/03 9:56 pm)
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thanks guys
Hello guys, thanks for all the suggestions..

i just ran a 2-day session over the weekend (it's now Sunday afternoon where i'm at) and i'm feeling a little dazed but pleased at how things turned out. my PCs had earlier been betrayed by Tal Chammish (who was disguised and under a false name, and had joined their party under instructions from Hedrack as a cohort - i boosted Tal up as a telepathic drug-pusher - mind blast rocks!) and stripped of their gear and sold to the sadist D'Gran at the fire bridge for a few "favours".

the PCs after some hard fights managed to escape the Fire Bridge and ran off to Verbobonc to recuperate.. and took a month off - both in game time and in real life, just doing side treks and side quests, because they were so terrified of the ToAC. Then they headed back to Rastor.. and they saw the place was destroyed and sacked, and all the villagers were decapitated and thrown into an immense pit, with Tymerian's skull nearby spiked to a spear and a sign "Let those who defy the Abyssal Scion D'Gran look upon this and despair. Kneel before my might."

This really ticked some of the players off - the mild-mannered ones wanted vengeance, while the hot-tempered ranger who worshipped Joramy became contrary and wanted to rebuild Rastor in reparation. The PCs decided to set up base and watch - their honour, their sense of ethics has been offended. Now they want to go in to kick D'Gran's butt, but am also feeling guilty for having caused Rastor's doom indirectly.. maybe they're beginning to become socially responsible? haha. I can try to tie in the links to "saving the world, one step at a time.." here.

xenoflare
A cup of coffee
(5/17/03 10:01 pm)
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How do you guys use Varachan and Thrommel?
Oh yeah, i was thinking of Jurrikath and all the other guys trapped in the ToAC and Fanes - would Varachan want to release them, and how would Varachan have interacted with them beforehand? Maybe Jurrikath still lives in a tortured state because of Varachan's suggestion, rather than having been fed to Thrommel or something? How do you handle Varachan's helping hand?

Some guys also suggested using Thrommel to create a vampire colony - i particularly like Blackthorne's take on Rerrid. In your experience, how does this vampiric plague affect your players?

Siobharek 
A guitar
(5/18/03 4:27 am)
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ezSupporter

Re: How do you guys use Varachan and Thrommel?
I haven't begun using Thrommel yet, but Varachan keeps a very, very low profile, IMC. He knows that he's got one shot at righting the wrongs he has done and that shot is a group who has proven itself capable by taking out at least two of the CRM temples.

In short, "my" Varachan noticed the party when Hedrack did.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Infiniti2000
A guitar
(5/19/03 8:09 am)
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ezSupporter
Re: How do you guys use Varachan and Thrommel?
Who said that the PC won't be recognized for his deeds? You might have read other threads about what the governments would do about helping the party. Maybe one thing they would do is award that particular PC with a barony if he can defeat the temple (with the help of his comrades of course, maybe with similar awards.

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