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Night Beast
(3/5/04 6:31 am)
Re: Planar Ally for the good guys
Okay, that's enough out of you. Quit ruining my points. :b

So, only the triad has Dark Pact. The point I'll (now) try to make is that even paying for a CR18 monster to help you when you are CR12 is ridiculous.

Briar Beast
(3/5/04 7:07 am)
Re: Planar Ally for the good guys
Cordo, The Third qualifies (DD5, int 16), and in fact, she has it.

Hmm. I've got an encounter with The Third outside of the ToAC planned IMC for possibly sunday's game, but I forgot about Unholy Pact. I guess she's always be travelling with a Planar Ally, considering that they're free, wouldn't she?

Any suggestions for an ally for her?

Cordo Crowfoot
(3/5/04 6:06 pm)
Re: Planar Ally for the good guys
Oops yeah actually I meant The First and The Third. The Second doesn't qualify.

Actually she probably wouldn't always have a planar ally with her because the spell still costs experience points. Also, dark pact can only be used once per week. But if she knows she is going to be in danger most likely a Bebelith if your players didn't end up facing it (sorry I forget) or a 12HD advanced Hezrou.

Speaking of advancement, I thought of another official "out" that would make it difficult to summon Kelvezu within the rules without adding any house rules. Since they can advance from 12 HD all the way up to 24 HD, it stands to reason that perhaps the number of the lowest form that haven't advanced at all are much more limited, and it is harder to get a name of a specific 12 HD Kelvezu entity. And those who were 12 HD would soon get enough "experience" if they are summoned enough to hit 13 HD and be out of range of the spell, so names gleaned from old texts may not be valid any longer.

If my players fight The First or The Third, fail to kill them, and then retreat, I probably will send a Kelvezu against them.

Briar Beast
(3/6/04 2:55 am)
Warning! Spoiler for Thicker Than Water
Hrm. The scene that may or may not be played out tomorrow is the final fight from Thicker Than Water, which I've woven into the RttToEE plotline. Are you familiar with it? If not, and you're interested, it's a free download on the WotC site, and a quick read.

The Third is going to be one of the 6 descendants of Charad (the son of Yan-C-Bin) participating in the ritual. The Third isn't quite sure what's going on, but she knows more about it than Migos does, thanks to her Dark Communion, and actually has been manipulating Migos behind the scenes. So the characters for this scene will be in 4 groups:

PCs: Hamish (Clr12), Chase (Ftr4/Rog5/Shd3), Cyr (Target PC, Rog7/Wiz4), Shalathal (Bbn9/Sor3), and possibly a new NPC (Pal2/Sor6/EK1-3?)

Migos's group (somewhat different than published in the adventure, due to some changes I made while 3.5'ing it, and some reactions to the PCs actions earlier in the plotline): Migos Fehr (half-air-elemental Clr6/Ftr6), Lara Fehr (half-air-elemental Sor9/Mnk2, consumed by ritual), Viggor Fehr (half-air-elemental Mnk10, the party was sick of rangers by this point so I changed him to a monk), Mertha (elf Rgr7)

The Third: By herself, or possibly with a planar ally? A bebilith would be awful for the party in this fight -- two item destroyers in a single fight is bad news. I'm thinking that a Vrock (advanced to 12hd) makes a good bodyguard for a travelling doomdreamer. The XP cost is a good point -- its not really free -- but I think she'd pay that when travelling for this mission, because she doesn't know what to expect and it's really important to the cult that she get the Air Binder (see below).

The Enemy: Nightwing

In 3.5'ing the adventure, I changed Nightslice, the sword that's waiting on the altar during the ritual, into an Intelligent Silver Greatsword +2 Undead Bane, with continuous Deathwatch and 10 ranks of Knowledge Religion. The interesting thing about this sword is that its alignment is LN -- it was created by the church of St. Cuthbert as a tool for destroying the undead to set right their crimes against the laws of life and death. It's intelligent, and will correctly assess that Shalathal (NN) is its most capable bearer, and will call out to her when it detects Lara being consumed by the Nightwing. Once (if) Shalathal takes it up, it will let her use it just fine until she tries to rage, at which point it there will be a contest of wills -- it only has an ego of 9, so it shouldn't be too much of a burden for her to dominate its will.

This is already a complex fight, so I'm not sure if adding a planar ally for the Third is going to make it even worse. Mind you, it certainly fits with her demeanor, and one more beast to soften up the Nightwing would certainly be nice.

When (if!) the Nightwing dies, it will drop the Air Binder. The Third knows this (or at least suspects it) -- that's what she figured out with the Dark Communion, and why she's been manipulating Migos into setting this whole thing up with the stories about the Presage of Forms. So she'll be working with the party and Migos's group against the Nightwing, and will try to stay close to grab the binder when it dies. Migos won't be fighting -- he'll basically be watching Hamish the whole time, readying an action to counterspell a Banishment or Dismissal from him, since that would foul the ritual.

I'm honestly not certain how this scene will work out -- the plan is for the Third to wait for the Nightwing to die, let out a Maddening Howl to stun the living, grab the binder and Word Of Recall back to the inner fane, leaving the PCs in Malison with the dead bodies of the Fehrs to loot. But the PCs might end up killing the Third, and end up with the Air Binder themselves. The party does know what The Third looks like -- I ruled that Chase could do the police sketch trick with his Shadow Images, and Varachan described her in enough detail -- besides, IMC, all doomdreamers are missing their left eye, so she'll be easy to spot. So they may pre-emptively strike her before the Nightwing is dead, which she won't be suspecting, since she doesn't know anything about them, having trusted Hedrack with such trivia as a party of do-gooders attacking the Fanes.

Edited by: msherman at: 3/6/04 5:01 am
Cordo Crowfoot
(3/6/04 3:35 pm)
Re: Warning! Spoiler for Thicker Than Water
Vrock advanced to 12HD sounds good. Also because it ties in with the Vrock encountered later in the Inner Fane (maybe she would summon a Vrock as she is used to them).

"They were immediately and absolutely recognizable as adventurers. They were hardy and dangerous, lawless, stripped of allegiance or morality, living off their wits, stealing and killing, hiring themselves out to whoever and whatever came... They were scum who died violent deaths, hanging on to a certain cachet among the impressionable through their undeniable bravery and their occasionally impressive exploits" China Mieville, Perdido Street Station

Briar Beast
(3/6/04 6:40 pm)
Re: Warning! Spoiler for Thicker Than Water
Yeah, that was one of the reasons I chose it. The other was because Hezrou smell. Even a Doomdreamer doesn't want to hang around with that. :) The good thing about the Vrock is that the big fight takes place in very cramped quarters on the open-air top level of a small tower, so having the flying vrock involved helps to open it up a bit.

Edited by: msherman at: 3/6/04 6:42 pm
(3/6/04 8:39 pm)
My Group...
My group uses this spell as frequently as I'll let them get away with. The danger of it seems to be, once the group figures out what is going on, they'll want their ally to be free (for a task that is aligned to the called creatures ethos - preventing the destruction of the multiverse should qualify here).

On topic, I'd go with the Leonal, as the Deva is pretty tough. My group summoned an Astral Deva, and the Aura of Goodness (or whatever it's called) is pretty awesome. Of course this is countered by the fact that the ally is vulnerable to Dismissal (either from the spell or from Blasphemy)

Ghoul Worm
(3/10/04 11:37 pm)
Re: My Group...
I'd go for the Deva. I have personal reasons behind that, but I would.

As for what he...or she? Requires in return...

That Deva could conceiveably require anything it wants in return...

Never mind the rates, I'd have the Deva require something lasting, that goes beyond the module.

During the battle?

Well, here's the acid test.

Run the Astral Deva vs the entire enemy forces. The Deva just might win...he IS ECL 20. And Holy Word at will will slaughter what he doesn't like.

Speaking of the neutral characters...When he goes to use Holy Word on the enemy, his disapproval of the neutrals will become evident...Holy Word will slam neutral PCs as surely as it slams the enemies...

Heaven's wish to destroy all minds! Holy Explosion!

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