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Siobharek 
Orc
(11/15/02 1:42 am)
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Re: What about this idea....
First of all, the sniper's headband seems to be just right. Making it available only to evil users cuts the price by 30% IIRC.

The whole thing does smack a little of tailor-fitting, I think. It's hard to put my finger on it, but at the very least the character as written seems like a bit of a one-trick pony. I mean, wow, he's got his bowmanship down, but apart from that he doesn't do anything, really.

How about keeping him, but making him human? Make him one of the nastiest assassins in the Wild Coast/Dyvers/Greyhawk area. And have the PCs catch a rumour that he's been hired.

As usual, I don't have my books handy (sorry), so I can't geek out the stats, but these are my fluffier comments.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(12/24/02 7:02 am)
Reply
A few more Questions
Hello all, and before I forget, Happy Holidays.

I have gone through a few game sessions since I last posted any questions here, and have come across a few things I'd like your opinions on.

First off, I'll explain what my PC's have done up to this point.

They have wiped out everything from the air temple up to room 106, where they encountered a strike force from the fire temple who knew they were coming. They killed all the low level cannon fodder, as well as knocked out Zert. Arlainth barely managed to escape.

They had also been payed a visit from Victor and Bethe. Xaod (9th level paladin) rushed right into their ambush and was quickly killed by sneak attacks. Both assassins attemted to flee, but Bethe was brought down.

After they teleported to Greyhawk to have Xaod True Resed, Snaggle (9th level 1/2 orc cleric) came up with a plan. They had Oskar (9th level dwarf druid) scry on the other assassin.
After spotting him in the statue room, they buffed up, and teleported into there while invisible and abducted Victor (they beat him to -5 hit points in a single round).

They then questioned him. He told them little that they didn't already know, and then the PC's mercifully killed him.

That takes us to the present.

Now for my few questions....

1. Can the PC's scry into the outer fane?

2. Can the PC's teleport into the outer fane?

3. Would the 4 elemental swords detect as evil? (currently Xaod is using hte sword of earth, and no, they haven't made a connection between hte swords and the alters. In fact the alters of the two temples they destroyed are still intact.)

4. What would Hedrack do now that both his assassins are killed? I'm thinking of sending out hte invisible stalkers, but I belive that those too will be slain by the PC's. I don't want to keep sending out Hedracks resources one by one to be killed by the group. Perhaps I should just wait till they come to the Outer Fane.

Thanks for your input.

Edited by: DM Dan76 at: 12/24/02 7:20:33 am
Thrommel
Can't leave now (mod)
(12/24/02 7:32 am)
Reply
Re: A few more Questions
1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Not in my campaign. YMMV.
4. Sending out Ukemil & the lions is the next standard tactic. Be sure to set up an ambush which utilizes the lions' rake attacks.

The assassins are there to send a message to the party, not to really kill everyone off. They need to whack one PC and then get out of Dodge.

Hedrack should also have a 'scouting report' of the PC's appearance and tactics by now and I would suggest organizing the CRM a little bit more to be tailored to the party's typical tricks.

-Thrommel, who's currently playing for the farm club but is hoping to get called up.

Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(12/25/02 1:31 pm)
Reply
Re: A few more Questions
Thrommel's spot on - oh and Happy Hols to all. Number 4 have some additional answers, but that depends a little how you see the various groups in the Outer Fanes:
The Naga: They can be a quite efficient strike force. One of them - or both and maybe in connection with Ukemil can be really lethal.
The Drow: These guys are quite indoctrinated and would probably do most of what Hendrack told them to.
The Invisible Stalkers: Personally, I don't see them doing an awful lot to the PCs (unless they can abduct a party member). But they would make excellent scouts for giving Hedrack the skinny on how the attack went.

Of course there are other resources to exploit - if the Spider Eaters aren't deployedon a daily basis, they should by now. If nothing else then to show the PCs that someone have begun taking them seriously.

Anyway, hope that helps :)

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(12/27/02 8:08 am)
Reply
Re: A few more Questions
Thanks for the input.

I already have the Spider eater Riders patroling the sky regularly. They have also frightened the PC's just a little.

I think i will have the invisible stalkers track and follow the PC's for a while as well. Question; can invisibility purge dispel the stalkers natural invisibility?

Next I was thinking of sending out Ukemil, but with a twist.
Some time ago I read a post here where someone was going to change Ukemil to a full 9th levle druid. I like the idea, as another low level cleric will just be mopped up by my players.

I converted Ukemil to a druid and after choosing which spells he would have on his list I came up with an idea. I was thinking of setting up an ambush in one of the large natural caverns. Ukemil's first action would be to cast Transmute rock to mud on the ceiling of the cavern, causing 18 10' cubes of rock to turn into mud and fall onto the PC's (the PC's always march in a straight line, grouped together). this would deal out a not bad 8d6 worth of damage. On the following round he would hten cast (from a scroll), transmute mud to rock. Now unless the PC's make their reflex saves they will be trapped in 5' deep stone. Looking at my PC's I expect 3 out of 7 to make their saves. The lions would then rush in and take care of anyonr not trapped in the stone and Ukemil would throw in a couple of flame strikes for good measure.

Now is this a vaild tactic to use? Is it too much?
The spell states that the falling mud pools to a depth of 5'. What would happen to a halfling or a dwarf in this mud? Would they be able to swim and get their heads above the surface, or would they sink like quicksand? If I mud to rock and they are under the surface I'm guessing they would begin to suffocate instantly.

Thanks for the responses.

Infiniti2000
Here for a while
(12/27/02 8:32 am)
Reply
ezSupporter
Re: A few more Questions
If you change Ukemil from Drd5/Rog4 to Drd9 you are not changing the encounter level any, so I think it is not too much. Your tactics are good, but you have to get the party into the correct natural cavern first. That probably isn't too hard though. Remember to remove his other scrolls to make up for the new, more powerful one (cost-wise, if you care).

If a PC makes the first save against the mud, I would say that they are no worse than half-in the mud (waist high). The spell does state that they are trapped waist or chest high, but that is from the ground turning to mud. A PC trapped underneath, though, would start suffocating. I would treat the mud like quicksand for swimming purposes (this should be in the DMG).

The invisibility on the stalkers is Supernatural, so it cannot be dispelled. In fact, the description specifically states that invisibility purge does not affect it.

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(12/30/02 11:11 am)
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Re: A few more Questions
The paladin in my group wants to purchase a magic item that allows him to inflict double damage while charging (like the rhinohide armor ability). Any idea what the cost of an item like this should cost him? I was thinking of making it a ring (and using up a valuble item slot), but any sort of item would do the job I suppose.

Rhino Hide Armor costs 5165 gp, so he thinks it should cost less than that. I told him I'd get back to him with the price.

P.S. I'm horrible at figuring out magic item prices.......

Thanks.

Thrommel
Can't leave now (mod)
(12/30/02 11:14 am)
Reply
Re: A few more Questions
I'm sure if you ask this question in D&D Magic you'll get a better response. That's where the real magic item pricing hondos hang out.

-Thrommel, who is not a magic item pricing hondo.

Edited by: Thrommel at: 12/30/02 11:14:24 am
Infiniti2000
Here for a while
(12/30/02 11:19 am)
Reply
ezSupporter
Re: A few more Questions
Wasn't Hondo the leader in S.W.A.T.?
Anyway, I agree with Thrommel. Since the question is not RttToEE specific, there would be no harm posting it in the other forum. I'm not a magic pricing hondo either. :D

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(1/4/03 1:25 pm)
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A Tactics question...
My group will most likely assult the fire temple next session and I wanted to run my planned defenses by you guys here and see if they can be improved upon.

Last session the PC's wipped out the advance guards the fire temple had set up in area 106. Zert was killed along with all the elve and human guards and 4 of the fire mephits. Arlainth managed to escape the destruction and fleed back to the temple, whereupon she warned Tessimon. The PC's then made their way thru room 110 and killed the hell hound in room 111. The groups fighter/sorceror scouted out hte rest of the area while both silenced and invisible. He even popped his head into room 121, the fire temple. By the clever used of silenced stones they killed the rasts in area 117 without alerting anyone. Low on spells, they have decided to go and rest before launching their assult.

Now for Tesimons plans.

I was going to place Tessimon, Firre, and Arlainth on the floating platform, which will be recessed into the roof. A mephit will wait near room 118 (their expected pont of entry) and alert the temple personel of the intruders. Skassik will be in the fire pit with some salamanders (which Tessimon brought form from the alter last night), and they will climb out and engage the PC's once the enter 121. This will sound the start of the battle, where Tessimon will then lower the platform down low enough so that Arlainth can cast fireballs down upon the PC's and Firre can lob the 2 remain fireballs from the necklace of fireballs. Tessimon will also throw down spells at the PC's, and they all will be sitting behind 9/10 cover.

Skassik will command the burning skels to join the battle, and the three on the platform will continu to throw down magic upon the PC's (and defenders alike since they are immune to fire anyhow).

If thing start to look bad for Skassik and the others, Firre will light the Candles and Tessimon will beat the drum, summoning forth the eye. She will also lower down the platform so that in a few rounds the eye will be in veiw of all the PC's. That will be their point for their last stand if need be.

So does that sound like a valid plan? Any suggestions?

I want this fight to be a tough one for the PC's. It has been a while since they were challanged, and I want ot show them why the fire temple is the toughest temple on the block.

Question on the eye in the alter. It lasts for 3 rounds, so do the PC's have to make saves against it every round if they are lokking at it, or does a save on the first round mean that they are safe from it?

Thanks.

Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(1/4/03 1:39 pm)
Reply
Re: A Tactics question...
Your plan seems sound enough as is. Remember that Tess will adjust her spell selection for whatever intelligence Arlainth brought back (invisibility purge springs to mind). As to saves vs. the eye: Normally, if you save against something, you're protected from it for some time. In this case you could decide either way: There is plenty of precedent for letting the PCs get away with one save, but with only 3 rounds of active time, it's hard to resist not having the eye call for a save each round. It depends on your party's Will save bonuses, I'd say.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

The guy from Belgium
Here for a while
(1/4/03 1:53 pm)
Reply
Re: A Tactics question...
in agreement with Siobharek, i'd say you can go about the eye two ways.

calling for a save every round might be harsh on your party, especially since the effects of the eye are pretty harsh! but hey, you're the DM :evil

on the subject of the rhinohide armor, i've read a thread about it on the d&d magic board yesterday!

Infiniti2000
Here for a while
(1/4/03 2:39 pm)
Reply
ezSupporter
Re: A Tactics question...
I would treat it as a typical gaze attack and make everyone save each round. This includes the bad guys. You can really drive this home by setting up a dumb mook that fails to look away, fails his save and dies (remember no extra XP for this mook). This should have a great effect on the party! What makes this encounter so difficult is that the bad guys (and Tessimon) are on the altar with their backs to the eye. So, to target them you need to look up. I'd think that this is what Monte intended due to the powerful nature of the altar and the strength of the fire temple.

The guy from Belgium
Here for a while
(1/4/03 3:07 pm)
Reply
Re: A Tactics question...
oh so very true

makes sense... adds to the EL of the encounter!

in my campaign, i'm gonna make it a save vs it every round (3 rounds), but then again, in my campaign ,the party can afford such a challenge *i hope*

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(1/8/03 6:56 pm)
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Re: A Magic Question......
.....Hold Person.

Who can this effect? Of course it can effect the humans and elves and gnomes etc, but what about monstrous humanoids?

This was brought up last session when the party sorceror cast hold person on Skassik. I said thanks for trying...it doesn't work. That brought form a debate from the player. He reaoned that the creature had a humanoid upperbody, and that the spell should effect him. In the spell description it mentions creatures with wings falling, and they reasoned that the spell would effect Skassik because of his humanoid upper torso.

I was in no mood for arguing, and they were getting kicked pretty bad at that point so I let them have it.

Afterward though I thought about it, and I still think that I was right.

So Who was right? I read the spell description again, and through the core rule books, but I can't seem to find anything.

Thanks.

Abelard
Still here? Wow.
(1/8/03 8:17 pm)
Reply
Re: A Magic Question......
DM Dan - you're right.

The key bit of the rules here is the target of Hold Person: "One humanoid of Medium-size or smaller". "humanoid" means a creature that's listed in the "humanoid" category in the Monster Manual. Skassik is an outsider - very definitely not a "humanoid".

It has nothing to do with what the creature's body looks like. My death priest Brael used Alter Self to gain wings in our last session - still vulnerable to Hold Person! My poor dead paladin Halli, an aasimar outsider who appeared fully humanoid, was not.

DM Dan76
Here for a while
(1/14/03 6:16 pm)
Reply
The Demonstone
I have a question about the demonstone found in Firre's room.

1. Would it detect as evil?

2. What would the appraisal value of this item be?

3. If kept in a bag of holding would the keeper of the bag still be effected by the stones power?

Also I was wondering about the prisoner the fire temple had (the human bard).

1. Aside from what is stated in the book, what else would he be able to tell the PC's?

2. Would he be willing to help the PC's or would he just want to get the heck out of there?

Thanks.

Edited by: DM Dan76 at: 1/14/03 6:23:49 pm
DM Dan76
Here for a while
(1/14/03 6:18 pm)
Reply
Water Temple Stratagies
My PC's have just defeated the fire temple.

That leaves only the water temple left standing and the earth bridge.

Would the water temple ever think of fleeing? Perhaps would they pull back into the outer fane?

Just a thought that crossed my mind. If I saw every other templ fall, even the mighty fire temple, I'd possibly think of running. But then again, I'm not an insane cultist.

Edited by: DM Dan76 at: 1/14/03 6:23:03 pm
Siobharek 
Still here? Wow.
(1/15/03 12:34 am)
Reply
Re: The Demonstone
Demonstone Q's:

1 - Absolutely. I used a fist that I pressed/snuggled into a player's hand to demonstrate how the stone snuggles in.

2 - Wouldn't an Appraisal depend on the powers of the item? Otherwise it's just a spooky rock - 50 gp to a demented collector, perhaps.

3 - General consensus here is no. A Bag of Holding is an extra-dimensional space and thus separated from the character.

The Bard:

I had him tell them vaguely about the Outer and the Inner Fanes - he was taken into the Inner Fane ("so many stairs...") after being tortured by warriors in the Outer Fane and in the Lightning Towers. Then Hedrack gave him to Stoneheart (a lich IMC who replaces the orcs) who in turn sold him to Firre Oranac. All that I made out to be a blur, though. I did mention Chymon the Red Dragon, though. 3e dragons are based on PCs knowing about them.

Also, I described how he was a mass of scars all over - except fopr his mouth and thrat area. That spooked my players.

Furthermore, I ruled that it would take a Greater Restoration to heal him, which my party paid for. I did not allow him to go with the group, but that was basically because my players couldn't be bothered to run him (or any other NPC).

Kelashein at the Water Temple is probably too much of a megalomaniac to consider leaving. The Earth Bridge might dig more in and consider banditry, but I don't necessarily see them leave. They might strengthen their preimeters, though. At least with some glyphs with sonic burst for that extra alarm effect.

Siobharek
...it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

smetzger
Here for a while
(1/15/03 6:13 am)
Reply
Re: Water Temple Stratagies
"Would the water temple ever think of fleeing? Perhaps would they pull back into the outer fane?"

I don't think they would be _allowed_ in the outer fane. If they can't hack the CRM they are not worthy to be in the outer fane.

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